Jezus Christus is de mensen gelijk geworden.

[Tomega 319]

Op 7-10-2024 om 21:35 zei Hopper:

Alleen in de zelfverloochening is de ziel kenbaar.  Zolang de mens zichzelf niet verloochent is het zelf alleen kenbaar als de persoon welke banden met de tijd heeft.   De geloste ziel heeft geen banden met de tijd.

De ziel is geestelijk, en overweegt daarom geestelijke dingen, als die ziel kennis heeft van het verschil tussen geestelijk en vleselijk. Zelfverloochening, is dat de ziel het vleselijke aflegt, niet meer begeert en zich er ook niet meer mee identificeert. Toch is het vleselijke de kaars en de tempel waardoor het licht van het geestelijke verbinding zoekt met deze wereld en haar bewegingen. Niet als een bruggenbouwer, en vereenzelviger, en gelijke van beweging en doen, maar juist als een licht en een bazuin en een ankerwijzer. En dan toch gelijk zijn van beweging en doen. Maar dan geheel anders. Want de ziel kan geen zieltjes winnen. Maar God kan dat, voor de ziel die zich keert tot het licht, en de duisternis vervloekt en aflegt. Het licht dat wij kennen, hebben wij in Christus, en wij hebben erkend en beleden dat Hij de Zoon van God is die de wereld en zijn geestelijke kinderen redt uit de ellende. Alsdan, en ook naar de ziel, nu.

[Barnabas 179]

Op 2-2-2024 om 18:16 zei Jahu:

Vers 7: Maar heeft Zichzelven vernietigd  ('deed afstand' vind ik beter). -- Wanneer was dat? Was dat toen het Woord vlees werd, en Hij een baby werd in de buik van Maria?

Vers 7: de gestaltenis eens dienstknechts aangenomen hebbende, -- Wanneer gebeurde dat? Was Hij een dienaar toen Hij een baby was, of als kleine jongen? Of was dat vanaf Zijn prediking van het Koninkrijk Gods?

Vers 7: en is den mensen gelijk geworden  -- Wanneer was de Heer Jezus de mensen gelijk? Was dat toen Hij uit de Heilige Geest werd geboren? Dat is alleen Hij! Daarin is Hij dus uniek, en helemaal niemand Hem gelijk. Was dat toen Hij opgroeide, en Gods engelen Hem beschermden? (Ps. 91:11,12) Dat heeft alleen de Heer Jezus Christus gehad, geen enkel ander mens. Was het misschien tijdens Zijn prediking, waarin Hij talloze mensen genas, de zonden vergaf, de doden opwekte, en over het water liep, en tenslotte het Offer voor de zondeschuld der wereld heeft gebracht? Dat heeft alleen Hij gedaan, niet één mens is Hem daarin gelijk geworden.

Ik denk namelijk dat de Heer Jezus Christus de mensen pas gelijk is geworden, toen Hij vanaf Gethsemane gevangen werd genomen, werd veroordeeld, geslagen, mishandeld, bespot, en uiteindelijk vermoord aan het kruis van Golgotha.

Dáár, in die lijdensweg en dood, daar was Hij de mensen gelijk geworden! De duivel had voor het eerst macht over Hem, zoals hij die voortdurend heeft over ieder mens die met zonde beladen is, en hij kon Hem pijnigen en vermoorden, om Hem in het dodenrijk te krijgen

 

Jezus liet zich met opzet aan het kruis slaan. Wanneer hij in de hof van Gethsemane is en bid vanwege de lijdensweg die voor hem staat zegt hij dat hij daartoe gekomen is. Jezus was zonder zonde en de duivel had geen ingang bij hem om hem te vermoorden. Maar Jezus verdroeg het lijden dat hem door de mensen aangedaan werd, mensen die wel door de duivel aangestuurd werden. Door de genade liet Jezus zich kruisigen, hij sloeg niet terug tegen hen die hem sloegen, ook niet hen die de spijkers door zijn lichaam sloegen of zij toe zijn kruisiging besloten hadden. Dus het was genade en geen zonde waardoor hij gekruisigd werd. Maar Jezus versloeg de dood door het lijden te aanvaarden, hij geen zonde had gedaan.

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[Paulus888 83]

Op 25-4-2025 om 19:57 zei Barnabas:

Jezus liet zich met opzet aan het kruis slaan. Wanneer hij in de hof van Gethsemane is en bid vanwege de lijdensweg die voor hem staat zegt hij dat hij daartoe gekomen is. Jezus was zonder zonde en de duivel had geen ingang bij hem om hem te vermoorden. Maar Jezus verdroeg het lijden dat hem door de mensen aangedaan werd, mensen die wel door de duivel aangestuurd werden. Door de genade liet Jezus zich kruisigen, hij sloeg niet terug tegen hen die hem sloegen, ook niet hen die de spijkers door zijn lichaam sloegen of zij toe zijn kruisiging besloten hadden. Dus het was genade en geen zonde waardoor hij gekruisigd werd. Maar Jezus versloeg de dood door het lijden te aanvaarden, hij geen zonde had gedaan.

In het OT staat heel duidelijk dat dit niet hoefde.. En God veranderd niet..

Citaat

2 Het is niet in den hemel, om te zeggen: Wie zal voor ons ten hemel varen, dat hij het voor ons hale, en ons hetzelve horen late, dat wij het doen?

13 Het is ook niet op gene zijde der zee, om te zeggen: Wie zal voor ons overvaren aan gene zijde der zee, dat hij het voor ons hale, en ons hetzelve horen late, dat wij het doen?

14 Want dit woord is zeer nabij u, in uw mond, en in uw hart, om dat te doen.

15 Ziet, ik heb u heden voorgesteld het leven, en het goede, en den dood, en het kwade.

Paulus heeft dit verzonnen.. Net zoals het idee dat de Wet er was om aan te tonen dat mensen die wet niet kunnen houden en dus genade en vergeving nodig hebben.

Ik vind het ook een vage reden om een Wet te verzinnen trouwens. Je kan ook de Wet aanpassen, dan kunnen mensen zich er wel aanhouden en probleem lost zich vanzelf op.